Dozens hurt as clerics clash in Jerusalem church

[fserafim]

When I was a student I remember having to put up with loud pop music on nights when I could have got a good night's sleep. When I was in the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in 1976, the Franciscans had the habit of playing their organ at full volume during the Divine Liturgy. I don't recall whether the door was open or not. I heard about this harassment when I was a child, how someone cut of a piece of carpet belonging to the Franciscans because it protruded into the Orthodox area etc..or was it the other way round?

Very sad to read the latest news. Helps us to rememer that we are human and subject to zeal not according to knowledge. Fanaticism is not always accompanied by fist fights.

[PFC Nektarios]

I wonder who won? :mrgreen:

[gphadraig]

Who won? Satan.............

[OrthodoxyOrDeath]

Helps us to rememer that we are human and subject to zeal not according to knowledge. Fanaticism is not always accompanied by fist fights.

I am little confused how this terminology can be applied here.

I would not characterize the recent incident at the Holy Sepulchre as “fanaticism” or “zeal not according to knowledge”. I would say it was simply people pursuing their passions. “Zeal not according to knowledge” is the ecumenical “love” all of these groups express for each other during their joint services around the world, which makes this incident very ironic. Perhaps one day they will solve their problems by having joint services at the Holy Sepulchre?

And fanaticism is often a matter of perspective: I am afraid most people today (IF THEY ONLY KNEW) would consider almost all of the Holy Fathers as being quite “fanatic”, but I don’t believe, with the exception of St. Nicholas, that they would punch anyone. So while you use the word "fanaticism" as a synonym to "zeal not according to knowledge", with the Holy Fathers, "fanaticism" is the same as "zeal according to knowledge".

[Tessa]

And fanaticism is often a matter of perspective: I am afraid most people today (IF THEY ONLY KNEW) would consider almost all of the Holy Fathers as being quite “fanatic”,

Give me a break, people think I AM a fanatic, even my own "Orthodox" family! People would have tried to lock the Holy Fathers up.

[Aristokles]

Sounds like the GREEKS started it.

Not according to the eye-witness report Anastasios posted at his site.

Jesuits

Demetri

[Schultz]

Umm...the Franciscans are not Jesuits.

Indeed, the Franciscans and the Jesuits often clash.

The simple fact remains that even if the Franciscan was standing there "putting up his dukes", so to speak, taunting the Patriarch, how does that justify attacking him during a procession of the Holy Cross? What happened to "turn the other cheek"?

They're both to blame for this disgusting display.