World Orthodoxy and the Name-Worshiping Heresy

DIscussion and News concerning Orthodox Churches in communion with those who have fallen into the heresies of Ecumenism, Renovationism, Sergianism, and Modernism, or those Traditional Orthodox Churches who are now involved with Name-Worshiping, or vagante jurisdictions. All Forum Rules apply. No polemics. No heated discussions. No name-calling.


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Barbara
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Re: World Orthodoxy and the Name-Worshipping Heresy

Post by Barbara »

Exactly, Maria ! We are so obviously different people with different emphases, particular fields of interest, and different
characters. I clearly like the Saints and like to study about monastics [my book came in yesterday "Letters to Nuns"
by St Anatoly of Optina [in fact, just after writing this about the Elders !]. Where you are actively involved with your husband, a reader to be, and parents. How amusing how quickly people leap to irrational conclusions.

About this, yes, I finally had the energy this morning to reach up a foot away above my computer and pull the volume down to check.
I knew it would be this book because it so long. I figured the selection you showed might be an Appendix, and it is.
The source of your page is :

Elder Barsanuphius of Optina by Victor Afanasiev. It's number 7 in the Optina Elders series published by St Herman of Alaska Press.

I also have an icn of this Saint to the right watching over my computer. He was in his pre-monastic life, apparently in military intelligence, I always recall this. o I figure he is a good one to ask to keep away 'spyware' and all the odious invasions possible when on the internet. More importantly, this sharp Elder can help with the invisible warfare of demons trying to attack.
[ Or people promoting ridiculous ideas, such as in the first paragraph above, wouldn't you hope ?! ]

I highly recommend this book and any on the Optina Elders. This is an aside for elsewhere, but the Elder Macarius one has gone out of print !! I fortunately have a copy but I always like keeping back-ups for special books.

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Isaakos
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Re: A New Name-Worshiping Book published by OCA's SVS?

Post by Isaakos »

Handmaiden50 wrote:
Maria wrote:

Please be careful. This Name-Worshiping (Name-Glorifying) heresy is so deceitful.
As Orthodox, we are to honor, but not worship the name of Jesus. However, the name-worshipers take it a step further and say that the name of Jesus is uncreated, is part of the uncreated Energies of God, and becomes a sacrament [dare I say magical] when uttering it with devotion, so that one does not need to receive Holy Confession and Holy Communion.

I want to avoid this error, but I still don't understand fully. Could you or someone else on the board elaborate more please. Thanks.

Here is the simplified version:

The heretics say: "The name of God is God himself!" But consider the name of "Jesus." It is a created thing, there was once when it was not. It was the name of the Incarnate Son of God. Since it is created, but God is uncreated, how can we say that it IS God? It is united to God, God abides in it, and those who invoke it with faith draw near to God, but the name, in itself is not God. A name does not have divine attributes:

It is not omnipotent, for there is once when it was not.
It is not omnipresent, for there was a time in which it cannot be found,
And it is not omniscient, for a name is a label, it is impersonal.

But God IS omnipotent, for he can do all things.
God IS omnipresent, for he is everywhere and fills all things and all times,
And God IS omniscient, for He, the Trinity, knows all things in all times.

How then can the name of God BE God when it in itself does not posses what makes God, God?

Some will say "The name of God is an energy that comes from God."

Again, this is impossible, there is no "name energy" in God, and this actually approaches the occult belief that when someone knows the "True Name" of a thing he possesses the essence of it. This Neo-Gnostic nonsense.

Again, the energies of God (His actions in time) ARE God, (For example, to say God IS love, or IS Justice or IS Mercy), because these attributes/energies have always existed in God, and since they are part of his essence participate in his three chief attributes we mentioned above as well as being uncreated.

But a NAME is just a label, a container in which we can pour a concept. It is therefore, again, created. For example, God's "mercy" is what it is even if it were called something completely different. The name is a label. And "Jesus" is who he is (The incarnate son of God) even if the Angel Gabriel had commanded him to be named Jason, or Bill. These things are just labels, containers. But the name is given to us for OUR understanding, and does not exist in God as God himself.

Blessed is the man who has volunteered to hold and keep until the end of his life our holy Orthodox faith, the faith of the one Church of Christ and our mother, the Catholic and Apostolic Church.

Archbishop Matthew Karpathakis

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Handmaiden50
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Re: A New Name-Worshiping Book published by OCA's SVS?

Post by Handmaiden50 »

That (Name-Worshiping) is just too messed up.

"Oh Christ my Savior, save me whether I want it or not! Come quickly, hurry, for I perish!"

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Maria
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Re: A New Name-Worshiping Book published by OCA's SVS?

Post by Maria »

Handmaiden50 wrote:

That (Name-Worshiping) is just too messed up.

Yes, and they are going through all kinds of hoops to justify their beliefs.

Lord have mercy.

Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me a sinner.

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Maria
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Another Russian Metropolitan Falls into Name-Worshiping

Post by Maria »

Beware that Metropolitan Damascene has fallen into the heresy of Name-Worshiping

For his original sermon in Russian, please see:
http://ispovednik-portal.com/stati/mitr ... rinadcatoe

His most recent sermon is translated from the Russian below:

[Machine Translation by Google Translate]

  • Letters spiritual daze. Letter thirteenth
    Mitropolit Damaskin

    Christ is risen indeed! Forgive me, my dear child, for such a delayed response. Somehow, not to conversations and emails I was recently. Then - one, - the other, then the third. And it is - one thing after another, the third - not only the church. (Oh, if only the church!). And sometimes there is a desire and quiet. And not only because the silence - "gold", and the word only - "silver". Increasingly, the soul needs peace and quiet, prayerful shutter from a variety of recreation and everyday troubles of everyday life. Even humanly, want more optimism and joy, a complete cleansing of sins, but there it all was. This autumn brings only sad and sad thoughts. This is despite its fabulous beauty and unique autumn freshness and purity. Alas, our worst come true forecasts and predictions. Some have openly called for the beginning of World War III. The devil comes in and out of them kindles, and people listen to the demoniac. The apocalypse, the arrival of the Antichrist, the end of the Light moves them is not the Lord, and fiends. Men make a choice - to resist them or not.

    Whatever it was, however, the time has come, my dear child, to answer your basic questions. Primarily on issues related to worshiping. Perhaps, from the very beginning of my priestly ministry and further, these questions haunt me, persecuted, as they say, on the heels, without losing its freshness and relevance. Knock on the heart and soul, require a solid and definitive answer and resolution. All the time had to look back and compare a lot to read, to think, to listen to different opinions. And God forbid wrong! Written and said many people. As in the one or in the other direction. Lies with the truth if people are thrown on the scales. And what do they outweigh? - Loudly and clearly, because, until now, and does not say.

    I imyaslavets. Why so? Because everything in God Holy, complete, and is inseparable from Him Ravnobozhestvenno. Including the name of God. If it is already open, it is said, spoken, and shall glory, then it can not be omitted, ignore or simply take, and casually overlooked. It's so obvious. And even more so can not deal with it, separated from God and speak at the same time that the name of God - not a God. It was discovered, it is said, is pronounced and glory of man as a kind of "new" song (Divine Energy) the glory of God. And this was done long before the elders of Mount Athos. It would seem, should rejoice, praise God, not to resent and do not fight with him.

    Calling on the Name of God (It is not alone the Jesus Prayer) and His glory, prayer - all my being, all my thoughts and feelings drawn to Him, merged with Him, filled (lit) love and faith, and, as the Psalmist prophesied in His famous psalm - sprinkled with hyssop, cleaned, washed and ubelyaetsya than snow. Who knew it, neither doth he will never be separated from God, the Name of God. For it is holy, Ravnoedino. And who does not know, it is better to be silent, to repent and pray.

    Not me, of course, to judge and, God knows, I'm not judging, but spiritually imyaslavtsy their persecutors and detractors.

    Imyaslavtsami were: Archbishop. Theophan of Poltava, St. John of Kronstadt, St. Theophan the Recluse, St. Seraphim of Sarov and the rest of our saints its roots stretching back centuries. It just so happened to Holy Russia (and not only for us) that a simple (monastery) and scientists (academic) monasticism often argued with each other, discordant, contrasted and jealous of each other. On matters of faith, of course. Worldly scholars and representatives of the white priesthood not take into account. They are little, in fact, depend. They listened, enraptured flight and freedom of human thought, they were awarded ranks, money, revered and praised orally and in writing. But again, they are little in Christ's Church depended. Theological disputes were resolved on a different level. Solved monasticism. In an extreme case, the Local Councils il Bishops with the direct participation and support of the Grand Duke - Orthodox Tsar - Autocrat. About us broadcast our story.

    The fullness of truth has always been, is and will be only the Lord our God, in the Holy Trinity, and only some part of her saving - at the Earth Church of Christ. For nurturing and show that the saving truth need Sobornost Church. In case of loss of Reunion, the usurpation of her worldly authorities or ecclesiastical functionaries, whether even the bishops, the truth is hard to find, hard to distinguish it and, if necessary, to show it to him that believeth common people. And one more important conclusion is not enough. Remember, my child, it. The absence of Reunion is almost always leads to a revolutionary (Satan) disturbances, loss of Christian love, active absorption and assimilation of diabolical malice, and as a consequence of all this - discord and schism church. That is, the person does not lead to God, Satan, takes him from the hope of salvation for the inevitable destruction - will not happen to him, of course, insights and repentance.

    In the early twentieth century in the Russian Church of catholicity already and did not smell. The Holy Synod, for the most part, was reborn, "reconstructed" and liberalized become more susceptible to outside influence - mundane squabbles, gossip and politicking, lost his faith in God and His Anointed - Orthodox Tsar - Emperor. Hence, all the Synodal woes, from servility powers that be, and so on. Negatives and their consequences are well known. Over prayer books and holy laughing, secretly and openly despise them, tried in every way to belittle, to drive away from the pilgrims, and pilgrims from the holy, to throw mud and defame. In this sense, is known for "skepticism" Archbishop. Anthony (Khrapovitsky) and Metropolitan. Vladimir (Epiphany). Volyn Archbishop disliked (and this is putting it mildly) St. Rights. John of Kronstadt, and Metropolitan of Kiev and Galich was unfounded claims to the Emperor himself. And they both openly and clearly hated the king's friend - Siberian elder Grigori Rasputin. Do not misunderstand me. I do not judge. Just as it was. On the other Sinodalami fared no better.

    Pride of the mind (and for me and just madness), desire for fame and unbridled power was overcome and began to rule over many bishops and Sinodalami that time. These vices as rust, corrode gradually bishop soul. The 13th year is indicative only known spiritless breakthrough when "abscess" of betrayal and retreat, finally broke, "pus" vicious poured out and showed his stinking essence.

    One often thinks and judge for himself, in terms of their spiritual development or improvement. This level may be different (someone high and someone and low). Hence, different outlook. The trouble is unlikely and the unbeliever is that he does not believe in the supernatural world, does not recognize and is not aware of his existence. For him and the natural world bezgorizonten, wide and, from the point of view of everyday understanding, very sufficient. Such a person, not rarely stops at the boundary of the natural world and our consciousness does not pass it. At best, he tries to understand and explore their scientific and technological developments to introduce into society, make them serve him. In the worst case, it takes the path of an open denial of the supernatural world, believing in God and rebellion.

    Taco also in church circles. Neither high spiritual Sana'a, nor glorious someone's confession, nor gold crosses and clothes, no good-looking, and even long-bearded righteous views define a man's spiritual nature, the level of its height. Obsessed and possessed enough and in the church environment. Remember Nicholas and his Nicolaitans, Arius and his followers Arians kalabriytsy Barlaam, who taught that the light of Tabor is, just, created being, and the generation of human consciousness, her husband scholar Origen, and so on, and so on. All they relied not on the heart and soul, not in the prayer divine revelation, not on a hot Orthodox faith and the holy simplicity and perfection, and the logic of his proud mind. The same sin, and sin all Catholics, Protestants, "the bishops' MP and other modern" Christian "sects.

    For Schemamonk Hilarion and his co-religionists Athos in the Name of God was present God himself - his whole being and all His everlasting properties. For Sinodalov, and those who stood behind them, in the Name of God, apparently, God himself was not present. For St. Gregory Palamas, as opposed to the heretical teachings of Barlaam, Tabor Light of God was inseparable from Being of God, because it is God Himself, that is, coming from him strength and energy, although God itself is not only light and only energy. Perhaps not sinned, if I say that for the Gospel of women suffering from bleeding for twelve years, the clothes of Christ, most likely, was inseparable from Him and equal to the divine, for barely touching it, she dried up the source of the blood, and she felt in body that healed of that plague. At the same time, Jesus, immediately knowing in himself that virtue had gone out of his strength (Mk. 29:30 5.).

    Now ask yourself, himself, on whose side are you on? On the side of Mount Athos prayer mystics - Hesychasts, felt in the Name of God, God in His fullness, or on the side of scientists bishops - Sinodalov, departed from the simplicity of heart, and came close to a mental perception and understanding of God.

    To know God only mind is like that little scoop Spoon salty ocean water - not me and told me not shown. No matter how much we do not like and they glorified God - it is impossible to reach the top in His glorification. Not in human and angelic is not in power and authority. Sinodaly may have thought differently. Based on the fact that the Athos elders, really overzealous in his prayerful glorification of God, so to speak, pray, pray and you - pray for forgiveness. Perhaps this implies vector (though not all, but some parts of it) is so ugly dirty, and no secular and Christian rules and laws invalid, a military solution to the case of Mount Athos, so similar to the expulsion of Metropolitan Vitaly (Ustinov) of New York Synod of the ROCA home.

    Plus - and even politics.

    The fact that the Greek temporal and spiritual power were vitally interested in weakening of Russian monasticism in the Holy Mount Athos, and even in his exile. They strongly contributed oslavleniyu, giving righteous voice imyaslavtsev status heretical unrest, created various intrigues and disadvantages, for example - placing all monasteries under the guise of pilgrims Greek soldiers and so on. His contribution to this dirty business has made and the Russian ambassador in Constantinople, MN Gears, then one of the leaders of Russian Masonic lodges in exile. This man took the role of organizer of police violence against monks imyaslavtsami. Delve into the details of lawlessness perpetrated I will not. They are described in detail, God willing, to read. Focus only on the individual statements of famous people of the time.

    St. John of Kronstadt, shortly before his death in a letter to Hieroschemamonk Anthony (Bulatovic) prophetically wrote: "Athos monks crown of martyrdom." Archbishop Theophan of Poltava is not considered (perhaps tongue-tied and their inability to competently and bezemotsionalno his theological position to explain) the Athos elders-imyaslavtsev quite so prominent theologians and indisputable, however, as they believed that "God - everywhere; and, of course, is in His Name. "

    Interesting and instructive note from April 15, 1914 St. Nicholas II Procurator of the Holy. Synod VK Sabler. The Saintly Emperor, anxious for the salvation of the souls of their loyal subjects, in the spirit of Christian love, tried to stop the feuds and disputes and put an end to such a notorious and unsavory "Athos business" monks imyaslavtsev: "On this Feast of Feasts - wrote VK . Said the Saintly Emperor - when the hearts of believers seek the love of God and neighbor, My soul is exceeding sorrowful about Athos monks who have taken away the joy of communion with the Holy Mysteries and comfort stay in the temple. Forget feud: not for us to judge the greatest shrine - the Name of God, and incur the wrath of the Lord to his homeland; the court should be abolished and all the monks, following the example of Metropolitan (Kiev) Flavian, place the monasteries, monastic orders to return them and allow the priesthood. "

    The note attributed to the influence of the opinion of St. Gregory Rasputin. Linked, of course, the enemies of Orthodoxy. I see no reason to listen to them and they indulge.

    If the created world man can not be known until the end, what we say about God is uncreated. But who please him, that He Himself reveals a little bit more. So now persecute and harass the saints of God? Forbid and have mercy on us, O Lord! On this I agree with you and say goodbye.

    Glory to our God. Amen.

    • MD

Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me a sinner.

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Re: Another Russian Metropolitan Falls into Name-Worshiping

Post by jgress »

Was he the one who broke from the MP over ecumenism a few years ago?

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Barbara
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Re: Another Russian Metropolitan Falls into Name-Worshiping

Post by Barbara »

A laugh from the line " Taco also in church circles".
Is that a new idea for Trapezas ?!

I didn't understand the part about Met Anthony, St John of Kronstadt etc. It's the machine translation. Anyone can negotiate that word salad ?!

Also, is Met Damaskin saying he is in favor of Rasputin, "the king's friend" ? He seems to make a big deal over Met Anthony, future First Hierarch of Rocor, and St John of Kronstadt's enmity for said Grigory. Strange...

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