extra ecclesiam nulla salus!!!

[El Batman]

extra ecclesia nulla salus!!!

question about orthodoxy. how many baptisms are there?

in roman catholicism there are 3. though 3 in 1 sort of like the trinity.

baptism of water, baptism of desire, baptism of blood.

the splinter groups and the mainstream church are in total agreement in all three and what all three mean= near total universal salvation. even a jew that knows of the name of jesus and hates his guts is elegible to go to heaven when he dies.

the stinking stupid traditionalist splinter groups simply don't care that the 3 baptisms were widely taught in the catechisms of pre vatican ii. and that therefore using the strict and logical conclusion of these baptisms equates into having the second vatican council (ecumenism galore).

the only ones teaching against this triple interpretation of baptism is vaticancatholic.com.

the Dimond Brothers have 20,000 followers and millions of views on YouTube. all of their junk they quote to attack baptism of desire and baptism of blood is from the 2nd millenium of the RCC. i mean the popes and councils from which they quote to attack.

the splinter groups attack the dimond brothers in millions of ways. "so you say st. pius x was wrong? 1917 cic? catechisms? hundreds of years of silence on the parts of the popes? how dare you!"

so does TOC have similar problems? if it does i don't see why i should convert. same theology different liturgy, i say.

ty.

[Maria]

extra ecclesia nulla salus!!!

question about orthodoxy. how many baptisms are there?

in roman catholicism there are 3. though 3 in 1 sort of like the trinity.

baptism of water, baptism of desire, baptism of blood.

the splinter groups and the mainstream church are in total agreement in all three and what all three mean= near total universal salvation. even a jew that knows of the name of jesus and hates his guts is elegible to go to heaven when he dies.

the stinking stupid traditionalist splinter groups simply don't care that the 3 baptisms were widely taught in the catechisms of pre vatican ii. and that therefore using the strict and logical conclusion of these baptisms equates into having the second vatican council (ecumenism galore).

the only ones teaching against this triple interpretation of baptism is vaticancatholic.com.

the Dimond Brothers have 20,000 followers and millions of views on YouTube. all of their junk they quote to attack baptism of desire and baptism of blood is from the 2nd millenium of the RCC. i mean the popes and councils from which they quote to attack.

the splinter groups attack the dimond brothers in millions of ways. "so you say st. pius x was wrong? 1917 cic? catechisms? hundreds of years of silence on the parts of the popes? how dare you!"

so does TOC have similar problems? if it does i don't see why i should convert. same theology different liturgy, i say.

ty.

I think the key word is "desire."

If a person sincerely desires baptism and is prevented from receiving Holy Baptism by an untimely death, then I firmly believe that if that person has repented of their sins, firmly believes in Christ, and has obeyed Christ's commandment to love all men as Christ has loved us, then Christ-God in His mercy will grant salvation.

Similarly, if a non-Christian witnesses the faith of Christians being martyred and dies with them, not really knowing Christ, but believing because of the faith shown by the Holy Martyrs, then again, since he is dying for Christ, then yes, Christ will save him.

"Lord, I believe, help Thou my unbelief." see Mark 9:23-25 (KJV)

However, Baptism is not magic. If a person enters the waters of Baptism, but does not really believe in Christ, and does not do the good works required of a Christian to feed the hungry, visit the imprisoned, clothe the naked, etc., then he will not be saved. Similarly, if a non-Christian dies with Christians, not because he believes in Christ, or has faith from witnessing the Holy Martyrs, but because he spurns the terrorists or atheistic government, then how can he be saved especially if he has hatred in his heart for the enemy?

[El Batman]

extra ecclesia nulla salus!!!

question about orthodoxy. how many baptisms are there?

in roman catholicism there are 3. though 3 in 1 sort of like the trinity.

baptism of water, baptism of desire, baptism of blood.

the splinter groups and the mainstream church are in total agreement in all three and what all three mean= near total universal salvation. even a jew that knows of the name of jesus and hates his guts is elegible to go to heaven when he dies.

the stinking stupid traditionalist splinter groups simply don't care that the 3 baptisms were widely taught in the catechisms of pre vatican ii. and that therefore using the strict and logical conclusion of these baptisms equates into having the second vatican council (ecumenism galore).

the only ones teaching against this triple interpretation of baptism is vaticancatholic.com.

the Dimond Brothers have 20,000 followers and millions of views on YouTube. all of their junk they quote to attack baptism of desire and baptism of blood is from the 2nd millenium of the RCC. i mean the popes and councils from which they quote to attack.

the splinter groups attack the dimond brothers in millions of ways. "so you say st. pius x was wrong? 1917 cic? catechisms? hundreds of years of silence on the parts of the popes? how dare you!"

so does TOC have similar problems? if it does i don't see why i should convert. same theology different liturgy, i say.

ty.

I think the key word is "desire."

If a person sincerely desires baptism and is prevented from receiving Holy Baptism by an untimely death, then I firmly believe that if that person has repented of their sins, firmly believes in Christ, and has obeyed Christ's commandment to love all men as Christ has loved us, then Christ-God in His mercy will grant salvation.

Similarly, if a non-Christian witnesses the faith of Christians being martyred and dies with them, not really knowing Christ, but believing because of the faith shown by the Holy Martyrs, then again, since he is dying for Christ, then yes, Christ will save him.

"Lord, I believe, help Thou my unbelief." see Mark 9:23-25 (KJV)

However, Baptism is not magic. If a person enters the waters of Baptism, but does not really believe in Christ, and does not do the good works required of a Christian to feed the hungry, visit the imprisoned, clothe the naked, etc., then he will not be saved.
Similarly, if a non-Christian dies with Christians, not because he believes in Christ, or has faith from witnessing the Holy Martyrs, but because he spurns the terrorists or atheistic government, then how can he be saved especially if he has hatred in his heart for the enemy?

hi maria!

yes, what you say is true. those are the strict intrepreations without wiggle room.

the mainstream church and the splinter cells expand on baptism of desire into being a sort of universal salvation.

my question is is there something similar going on in either WO or the TOCs? universal salvation and stuff.

are there 3 in 1 baptisms?

the mainstream church and the splinter cells don't want to say that baptism is the only way into the church of christ and to salvation.

the splinter cells in particular play with john 3:5 by saying "yes, i believe this literally", while at the same time on the other side of their mouth will say "well, i'm not sure but i think it's possible to go to heaven without believing in jesus."

baptism of desire and blood are vehicles for these people to say that there is universal salvation.

so is there something like this going on in TOCs or WO?

ty again.

[Justin Kolodziej]

Ah yes, the Dimond brothers. Like all the sedevacantists they haven't bothered to look fully at Church history, because if they did they would have to conclude the see of Rome has been vacant since 1015, or 1054, or being extremely generous 1276 at the very latest when the Council of Lyons adopted as dogma "the Holy Spirit proceeds eternally from the Father and the Son as from one principle...this is the teaching of all the Latin and Greek fathers and doctors"...certainly a blatant lie!

I think, from my reading, there are Orthodox saints with various opinions on the matter of salvation (in the limited sense of not being in Gehenna forever) without baptism, and there's no final conciliar conclusion on the matter to the present day.

[Maria]

extra ecclesia nulla salus!!!

question about orthodoxy. how many baptisms are there?

in roman catholicism there are 3. though 3 in 1 sort of like the trinity.

baptism of water, baptism of desire, baptism of blood.

the splinter groups and the mainstream church are in total agreement in all three and what all three mean= near total universal salvation. even a jew that knows of the name of jesus and hates his guts is elegible to go to heaven when he dies.

the stinking stupid traditionalist splinter groups simply don't care that the 3 baptisms were widely taught in the catechisms of pre vatican ii. and that therefore using the strict and logical conclusion of these baptisms equates into having the second vatican council (ecumenism galore).

the only ones teaching against this triple interpretation of baptism is vaticancatholic.com.

the Dimond Brothers have 20,000 followers and millions of views on YouTube. all of their junk they quote to attack baptism of desire and baptism of blood is from the 2nd millenium of the RCC. i mean the popes and councils from which they quote to attack.

the splinter groups attack the dimond brothers in millions of ways. "so you say st. pius x was wrong? 1917 cic? catechisms? hundreds of years of silence on the parts of the popes? how dare you!"

so does TOC have similar problems? if it does i don't see why i should convert. same theology different liturgy, i say.

ty.

Christ asked His Apostles and Disciples to go into the whole world baptizing people.
Furthermore, Christ God stressed the importance of the Eucharist. If we do not receive His Precious Body and Blood, then we cannot enter Heaven. The Gospel of St. John 6 explains this very clearly.

Baptism purifies us, but Holy Communion sanctifies us. The Divine Liturgy is the Mystical Banquet, to which the entire world is invited to partake, but only those wearing the white robe of Baptism can enter and eat. The Divine Liturgy is the Heavenly Banquet, for when we attend the Divine Liturgy, we are mystically transported into Heaven to celebrate the Feast of the Lamb with all the Angels and Saints.

The book of Revelation describes this Feast of the Lamb, but Protestants misinterpret it to be only an End Times scenario.

We do not know much about the afterlife, but we know the means to get into Heaven: prayer, obedience to Christ's commandment to love our enemies and our neighbor as Christ has loved us, reception of the Holy Mysteries, and a lively faith with perseverance.

[El Batman]

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[El Batman]

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