In Response To Slander Of Elder Ephraim

News about traditional Orthodox monastics and how these monks and nuns are living out their vocations in monasteries and convents. All Forum Rules apply. No polemics. No heated discussions. No name-calling.

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Kollyvas
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distortions & remorse...

Post by Kollyvas »

Please consider how others have effected people and appreciate their remorse with kindness...
R

https://listserv.indiana.edu/cgi-bin/wa ... &S=&P=6489

A while back when David Smith first posted here, I made the grave mistake
of collaborating some of the things he said. I had no idea of his motives
or to the extent he was willing to take this. Once that became apparent to
me, I publicly distanced myself from my initial posts....

https://listserv.indiana.edu/cgi-bin/wa ... &S=&P=6609

Last edited by Kollyvas on Tue 7 February 2006 2:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Kollyvas
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Borrowing...

Post by Kollyvas »

Let's keep perspective on the fact ORTHODOXY IS UNDER ASSAULT, and refrain from snyed legerdemain. I will go ahead and edit the posts in question so that she will be quoted as having her point CONSIDERED AND RESPECTED but not in any possible way agendized. Kyrie Eleison!
R

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The Thread

Post by Kollyvas »

This thread is clearly labelled and its context clear. Enough has been presented in the past few days to show just exactly how dire a situation we have. I have edited the post. If you have further concerns including correcting my spelling and my criticism of certain petty pedanticisms (Viz. SNYED), do so on your own thread. I think we are capable of at least that meagre modicum of respect...
R

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Kollyvas
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From St. Poemen The Great Brotherhood

Post by Kollyvas »

http://members.cox.net/orthodoxheritage ... 05%20B.htm

In Defense of Monasticism

By the Brotherhood of St. POIMEN the Great


In the past few months, there has been a renewed attack on traditional monasticism in America of the kind that has not been witnessed thus far. A "self-proclaimed" ex-disciple of the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese monasteries (and most specifically St. Anthony's Greek Orthodox Monastery) has unleashed a series of fabricated allegations and misconstrued impressions that have caused great sadness among several faithful, both in America and elsewhere. This person has benefited greatly through his past association with the monasteries, both financially as well as spiritually (and as indicated by his own written statements and stories of just a year or so ago). The reason for his current spite against the monastics is a mystery to many, yet it is strongly suspected that he is encouraged by others and is very likely serving the dark interests of a few special groups that have for a long time now considered monasticism their “enemy.” This person’s allegations / fabrications have been posted in various discussion forums and electronically disseminated by his supporters. It has also become apparent (through various e-mails that our Brotherhood has received) that any strong voices of support for the monastics and Elder Ephraim are being electronically squashed and pertinent posts mysteriously disappear. In the mean time, these same allegations / fabrications have since become the topic of discussion for many pseudo-orthodox groups, and pretentious laity individuals which have taken great joy to further attack that which they cannot possibly comprehend.

We have never hidden the fact that we are avid supporters of traditional, authentic Orthodox Monasticism of the type that Elder Ephraim has brought to America; we consider it an absolute blessing for our wonderful nation to have close to 20 monasteries that practice and teach true Orthodoxy, in spite of the continued vicious attacks by those who utilize Orthodoxy for their own self-motivated political or monetary gains

While we have been for the most part absent from the related discussion forums, we found it necessary to respond and uncover some very obvious lies and disgusting innuendos which this individual maintained as true. Subsequently (or concurrently) others who have known this individual and his peculiar past have come forth to reveal some very specific facts which have completely destroyed this person’s credibility. This course of events has once again established that the monastics (who remain silent and never defend themselves against any and all these vicious attacks) are on the right and this attack shall pass as well.

In an effort to shed some light on this entire dark affair and the various improper allegations, some laity individuals have taken it upon themselves to develop some small websites wherein some excellent information is provided to clarify any questions which the Orthodox faithful may have as it relates to the aforementioned innuendos and allegations. We strongly recommend that our readers consider visiting and reviewing the material therein in detail. It is absolutely refreshing to observe the utilization of our Holy Fathers' writings to demonstrate the validity of the monastics' teachings and position. These websites are:

I. Orthodox Patristic Wisdom

and

II. J O Y F U L L I G H T

Enjoy them -- they are indeed excellent!

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Kollyvas
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Regarding "Orthodox Fundamentalism"

Post by Kollyvas »

http://www.orthodoxnews.netfirms.com/14 ... talism.htm

Regarding “Orthodox Fundamentalism”

I visit your page from time to time. The article "Orthodox Fundamentalism" written by Nicholas Cobb saddens me. It is full of a lot of rhetoric without much substance. I would like him to answer some specific questions.

  1. If there is any insistence on some kind of dress code, please clarify your basis for being against it. Are you saying that long ugly dresses and babushkas should not be pushed on people or are you saying they should not be worn at all? I personally think long ugly dresses are better suited for church than the latest fashions. I also find it interesting that with very few exceptions the female saints are depicted in the Holy Icons with head coverings. Why do you think that is? Do you think St. Paul's writings about head coverings no longer apply? If so, why?

  2. Why should Orthodox clerics not wear cassocks? What is the justification for wearing western priest suits? Are you saying the former is wrong or just should not be?

  3. Why should an Orthodox believer be so concerned with what is ugly, scraggily or funny-looking? Nowhere in the beatitudes do we see a "Happy are the pretty and well-dressed".

  4. Give specific examples of "traditional Orthodox" things that are preached by the fundies that really are not Orthodox.

  5. Is there something wrong with adhering to pre-1900 customs? How about 33 AD? Are you saying that we need to get with the times? What specifically is right about the "modern" methods?

  6. Are you saying that only clerics that have higher education should be looked to for correct doctrine? Do Galilean fisherman have an exemption from this requirement?

  7. More comfortable on Mount Athos? Are you saying that Mount Athos types should not be allowed to roam amongst us more educated, better dressed folks? Do you believe that there are different Orthodox standards for different classifications of believers (lay, clergy, monk)?

  8. Is it possible to follow the letter of the law and also follow the spirit of the law or are you insinuating that they are mutually exclusive pursuits.

  9. You say "complicates teaching of what Orthodoxy really is in following Christ." What is Orthodoxy, really?

  10. The first followers of Jesus Christ were a cult. As a matter of fact, after Jesus told his followers to eat his flesh, many people left appalled at what they were hearing. Do you believe that Holy Communion is Jesus Christ's flesh and blood? Orthodoxy IS a cult like almost every other form of religion. What about AHEPA, MASONS? They don't follow traditional Orthodoxy and they wear funny hats; yet I don't hear too many educated Orthodox speak against them, although they are cultish and probably have no place in the church.

  11. You mention a clash. I agree that there may be a clash, because the Kingdom of God is not attained with political correctness. Our Saviour was hung for being "politically incorrect", why should his followers expect any different?

It seems to me that since many people claim to be Orthodox, and there are many approaches and beliefs interspersed in the Orthodox community, cognitive dissonance kicks in and we feel the need to put down those who disagree with us. However, Orthodox Tradition believes in absolute Truth. The believers who choose to wear head coverings, frequently confess, frequently commune and support the wearing of cassocks and beards obviously should not be judging those who do not and vice versa. However, I get the feeling that there is more oppression coming from the modern crowd against the "traditionalists" than the other way around.

Peace,

Art Karros

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Post by Ekaterina »

Rostislav,

Sometimes you simply negate all the good you attempt to do by your reaction to critisism and comments.

A little less offense on your part would greatly help your cause, especially in this case.

Katya
:ohvey:

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Kollyvas
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Personal Issues...

Post by Kollyvas »

I understand how some may have personal issues with myself, take them to another thread. Say what you want. Since I do not know you nor have any desire to know you, I keep things on topic when I post on your opinions. Showing like respect is common courtesy. Please, don't address me personally.
R
Now ROCOR and her allies want to derail a thread defending Orthodoxy...Why did you people bother deposing puhalo?! LOL!

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