ROCOR-L UNANIMOUSLY VOTES TO UNITE WITH MP!

Priest Siluan · Post by **Priest Siluan** » Fri 28 July 2006 11:20 am

This is not a real "reunification" of the Russian Church, sadly still not had arrived the time for this, but God will grant, completing the Prophecies about the restoration of the Russian Church and the Holy Russia.

That that is happening now is not truly a "reunion" or "restoration", but a subjection of a part of the Russian Church (ROCOR-L) under a modern insttucion so-called "Patriarchate of Moscow" that anything has to do with the Historic Patriarchate of Russia, but rather it is an organization para-ecclesiastical that have seen founded with political reasons by Stalin and a traitor in 1943.

Sadly some are falling in the sinister and current ROCOR-L revisionism that denies the true history of the Russian Church.

scwaterfowl · Post by **scwaterfowl** » Fri 28 July 2006 11:58 am

With all due respect, that is absolute garbage.

Sean · Post by **Sean** » Fri 28 July 2006 3:55 pm

scwaterfowl wrote:
Every single point that's been thrown has been discredited.

If only that were true, then I wouldn't have left ROCOR. The fact of the matter is that ROCOR has already lost a full third of its faithful over this betrayal of the Church to the Sergianists.

Pat. Alexey did publicly repent for collaborating with the Godless authority, but neither he nor any of his other hierarchs, to my knowledge, have ever admitted to being actual agents in the KGB. This was discovered when Fr. Gleb Yakunin had published recently declassified documents in the early nineties, for which he was reprimanded, which managed to leak to the western media before a lid was put back on the information. It was discovered that Pat. Alexey was the KGB agent Drozdov.

Although the MP glorified the New Martyrs, they deliberately excluded St. Joseph of Petrograd from that list, because he was the founder of the Catacomb Church. Before the repose of St. Philaret, ROCOR had always identified with the Catacomb Church and prayed for this persecuted part of the Church. It was only the ecumenists and Sergianists who at that time denied the existense of the Catacomb Church. Now ROCOR too denies this Church's existense, even though they continue to be persecuted in Russia.

Now, three of the most pro-Sergianist priests in ROCOR: Fr. Alexander Lebedeff, Fr. Seraphim Gan, and Fr. Victor Potapoff, are making pilgrimages to the Ecumenical Patriarchate in Constantinople and being recieved as guests by Pat. Vartholomeos. This all stinks to high heaven!

What has been discredited?

michigan · Post by **michigan** » Fri 28 July 2006 5:30 pm

"Now, three of the most pro-Sergianist priests in ROCOR: Fr. Alexander Lebedeff, Fr. Seraphim Gan, and Fr. Victor Potapoff, are making pilgrimages to the Ecumenical Patriarchate in Constantinople and being recieved as guests by Pat. Vartholomeos. This all stinks to high heaven!"

So it's a big scandal to even make pilgrimages or talk to other Orthodox? I for one think the Orthodox church must be united and stop squabbling. I don't mean that we traditionalists should compromise our views. But the best way to influence others and pull them back in the right direction is to talk to them.

scwaterfowl · Post by **scwaterfowl** » Fri 28 July 2006 10:00 pm

Sean,
Quit looking for something that doesn't exist.
Since when is going to Constantinople a sin? I hope they got the grand tour and had a great time. If that's all y'all can come up with, this is sad.
Everything; and I mean everything, that has been posted on this site in opposition to the reunification of the Russian church has been either gossip, exaggerations, conspiracy theory, or irrelevent. Almost like the World Weekly News; I'm waiting on fotos of Russian bishops with horns, marrying Martians, or communing Elvis.

Sean · Post by **Sean** » Sat 29 July 2006 12:24 am

scwaterfowl wrote:
Sean,
Quit looking for something that doesn't exist.
Since when is going to Constantinople a sin? I hope they got the grand tour and had a great time. If that's all y'all can come up with, this is sad.
Everything; and I mean everything, that has been posted on this site in opposition to the reunification of the Russian church has been either gossip, exaggerations, conspiracy theory, or irrelevent. Almost like the World Weekly News; I'm waiting on fotos of Russian bishops with horns, marrying Martians, or communing Elvis.

It's interesting how you didn't address the previous two, more important points that I made, but relied on a broad, sweeping statement to call the very real persecution of Catacomb Christians in Russia "gossip, exaggerations, conspiracy theory, or irrelevent". Do you have a veneration for St. Joseph of Petrograd? Are you aware of the fearful meaning and significance of an anathema? Are you aware that ROCOR anathematized the ecumenists in 1983? All the pro-Sergianists who disgusted me right out of ROCOR seem uninterested in addressing these issues either. Look for something that doesn't exist? I wasn't looking for any of this! I'd rather the last six years in ROCOR's history to have never happened. People with a lukewarm to liberal attitude about heresy don't believe in the Holy Fathers and they don't really believe in the Orthodox Church.

scwaterfowl · Post by **scwaterfowl** » Sat 29 July 2006 11:55 am

I'll address the others...
Many of the Catacomb churches are now by their own choice in the MP.
Were you there? Where did you get your information? Whose confessions have you heard? None of it bothers me in the least. KGB agent? Who cares; just as most Germans were Nazis before 1945.
Before there were talks, there were things on both sides that were misunderstood; communication and prayer have made things much clearer.
You made your choice; I wish you the best.
As far as exaggerated claims are concerned, where do you get 1/3 of the Church Abroad has left? I know of a couple churches and monasteries that have joined the JP and others that have joined the MP; I know of none that have left the Synod because of something that has not happened yet.