MP bishops meeting free mason dignitaries.

[Kybihetz21]

Not to downplay the events but it was always the joke in ROCOR that Hilarion was so naïve/unsuspicious and polite that he would have certainly invited the Devil to tea, if opportunity presented. The joke extended to his unwise ordinations/receptions of various clergy who eventually became an eyesore for ROCOR and his readiness to even ordain a cow if at the question of her willingness to become a priest she would just answer with a: “moo”.

[Catherine5]

Kyb, I read this at the time and was so pleased that there is someone very diplomatic on this site. Congratulations to you, as well as a belated Happy Namesday. I'm sorry I haven't been on here for awhile.
Partly because I felt disgusted that NO one even cared about this absolute outrage.
The clergy have a good reason, as they probably were not originally in the Old Rocor. Perhaps there is little interest in the meanderings of the mediocre "metropolitan" Helarion on their part which is understandable.
But so many of the rest of us had experience to some extent with the Old Rocor. Thus, it's a big shock to see this.

I had been planning to say that the cow example is funny.
However! A chronic bumbler needs to be examined They are not just stumbling around making goofs. But in my estimation, the continual, repetitive making of wrong decisions indicates the influence to a very Marked extent of demons or bad spirits. This is true for all. From the hieraarch to the person who cleans the candlewax from the floor in the Church.
I wanted to make this point because I learned the hard way that mistakes when in such copious quantity, are no accident. The person is under the total guidance of demons.
If this sounds strong, it's what I have observed firsthand in those who are "possessed", often taking the form of Multiple Personalities. That psychological syndrome could be called Multiple Demon Possession.

What you wrote, in kindly, non-condemnatory tones, indicated immediately that Helarion is not "here". Demons probably come and go in and out of his mortal frame.
One must realize this. Not just he, too, but those who enthusiastically support him.
It means he could never be trusted for anything. His word would not ever be dependable, for example. Look back at the by-now famous picture of him as Father Hilarion together with the layman John Shaw. Look at his eyes! He looks frankly, weird - I'm going to say that forthrightly!

I have maintained on here before that Helarion's supposed good-naturedness has been cultivated for a purpose, or as a stage prop. Perhaps to allay suspicion of his both corporeal and incorporeal masters' real agenda?
"Oh he's too 'nice' of a guy to ever consort with Masons" the average person will "cover his behavior with love" and say.
But with this type of porous person, a plaything of any floating spirit passing by, charitable observers are merely deceving themselves.

One who was NOT deceived, I felt encouraged to find, was a Jason B. - see next part

[Catherine5]

Well now the discussion over on nftu-news.blogspot.com has progressed into other dimensions. I see I don't agree with Jason's take on Sergius.
But after reading with difficulty--- [that site is really difficult to deal with, unlike the far better set up Euphrosynos Cafe. I wish the Suaidens would update it further to make it less unwieldy, a side note]--- the traditionalist Jason's opinions about Masonry, I am thrilled that this guy also believes idea that Met Hilaire is way out in outer spiritual space - and deserves punishment for it.

What's difficult to believe is that the interlocutors, some Hieromonk Ambrose of unclear origin, and the blog's owner, seem to fall all over themselves apologizing for the MP's servant, Met Hilarion!

Whereas my feeling immediately upon reading the supposedly explanatory email was that the titular head of ROCOR-MP is not telling the truth.
Jason seems to agree. He termed Hilarion's reply, "dubious".

What surprises me is that most everybody else has so easily been easily duped.

As I said earlier, no one can trust a person who may well have Multiple Personalities/Demonic presences. They easily lie or falsify. Some are even compulsive liars.
A person who tells the Truth 100% of the time never has a single bad spirit around him or her.
But let's say for argument that Hilarion's spiritual health is fine, he has no serious problem as I suggest above.
The letter does NOT ring true.
Only a naive person would believe it on face value.
The Masons themselves in their article make it more clear that some sort of conversation DID take place about furthering so=called spiritual values in South America or maybe, who knows, they are really gunning for worldwide connection with the Orthodox and any other faiths who will cooperate?
So why did Hilarion only say they asked for a snapshot? He made it sound like he is a pop star being solicited for photos constantly by screaming fans.
But even if THAT were true, he is NOT a rock star. He has to act like a responsible chief executive of ROCOR-MP and consider that each person who snaps a photo posed with him may publish that. It would behoove Hilarion to inquire FIRST which type of person this is who is requesting to have a photo together.
Hilarion was made a Bishop ---against the will of Metropolitan Philaret, note! - did the holy Metropolitan foresee all this??? ---
TWENTY-FIVE YEARS AGO!
He is not a spring bishop! In short, who could be excused for youthful indiscretions
They are celevbrating this occasion in a mere week or two, it's no secret.
So there had to be much more to the picture than what he is telling us by that email.
The other amazing thing to me is that everybody is acting like it's just great for him to be hobnobbing with an MP local authority at the Russian Embassy!
Five years ago, that would have been cause for immediate dismissal in the Old Rocor, at least before Abp Mark controlled much.
I find it reprehensible myself that Hilarion can't do anything else on a trip to South America. One assumes that the Russian Embassy invited the Masonic dignitaries maybe to bring them together with Hilarion...?

[Catherine5]

Third part:
I had felt upset that with 1118 members here, though many are inactive currently, but even if 20 % of that number occasionally reads this site, that no one cared to post anything about the Masonic scandal.
To me, it's proportionally a FAR FAR worse level of magnitude than Governor Mark Sanford's escapade on his South American trip last June.
Too bad the press hasn't been given access to Hilarion's emails exchanged with his new friends so we could discover the real details!
Let's not forget that Masons have long been active in many foreign countries. One hears unconfirmed assessments that for example: the U.S. has very close relations with both Brazil and Portugal; perhaps Masons have been working both places particularly actively.
Don't laugh, but just remember the scene in "The Miracle of Our Lady of Fatima" where the evil MASONIC MAYOR of the town imprisoned the 3 children visionaries. A classic villian, he threatened to boil the little shepherds in oil to get them to reveal their secret. So we know from that story that Masons held powerful positions in the Portuguese government even back in the early years of the last century!
Perhaps the same network was set up in Brazil thanks to a push by American businessmen/politicians.
But now we see the Masons friendly with Russians either instead or as well as North Americans.

I think there are many unexamined aspects to this which go deep.
Finally, the answer to those who shrug off the implications of the notorious photo is that no one expected this from ROCOR, which made anti-Masonic campaigning a pillar of the Church's belief system. Yet, in a few short years, here the degenerate current metropolitan is, partying with higher-level Masons, so congenially that he consented to be photographed together.
Was he drinking?

If so, the one good thing ROCOR-MP deserves credit for is their new Akathist, a welcome contribution to tackle exactly such problems. Here is their account:

"Service of Intercession For Those Suffering From Alcohol of Drug Dependance".

"Alcohol and drug dependence is among the most serious threats to Orthodox Christians, especially young people. It is extremely widespread throughout the world.

"In Russia it has been most common for those struggling with alcohol dependence to read the Akathist to the Theotokos before Her Icon "Inexhaustible Cup" or the Canon to the Martyr Boniface.

"In the West many people ask for Molebens to be served to St. John, the Wonderworker of Shanghai and San Francisco. But until now no special moleben with specific petitions and prayer for relief from alcohol abuse or drug addiction.

"This moleben is the Russian Church Abroad's contribution to the battle against alcoholism and drug dependence, an aid to priests, and is released to comfort and console both those who are struggling with alcohol and drug dependence and those who are close to them and love them. The English version of the moleben is due to be published by Pascha 2010."

[Jean-Serge]

Actually, my blog has deceided to report the facts simply... without comments.

1° Meeting between bishops and free masons

2° Metropolitan Hilarion's denial

The text "the masonic friends of MP" was far-feteched and a little provocative. I agree that many things are unclear in this affair and maybe both versions are wrong. I think that Metropolitan's Hilarion may have told the lodge not to answer to questions in order that everthing remains unclear.

http://orthodoxie-libre.over-blog.com/a ... 17005.html

[joasia]

Catherine wrote:

I had felt upset that with 1118 members here, though many are inactive currently, but even if 20 % of that number occasionally reads this site, that no one cared to post anything about the Masonic scandal.

I can only speak for myself. I know what's going on. I know who the players are, but I stopped obsessing about it, because I have bigger issues to deal with...my repentence. But, I am aware of it (their activities), as I'm sure many other members are too. I had to leave my church because of the MP union. So, don't think that nobody cares.

I used to be like you. But, it just kept me distracted from the real goal that God wants us to pursue. So don't judge us for not wanting to jump on your band-wagon of mason-hunting. The fast has begun. These mason issues are useless for our repentence. Enough is enough. Find some peace in your own life and focus on the spiritual matters for the salvation of your soul. Satan loves to distract us. Remove yourself from that trap. You're not doing any good for yourself, with this.

God will arrange everything, with these people.

Joanna

[Catherine5]

Joasia, the minute people use that tired old expression about "judging", my eyes glaze over.
If you want to spend your time exclusively "in repentance" that's fine.
But there's no spiritual law that one cannot do both at the same time; they are NOT mutually exclusive.
Besides repentance is a passive thing. Why not be ACTIVELY engaged in making up for whatever one feels that they have done wrong? If anyone spoke too meanly to somebody, then he or she could be extra-kind and warm to the next soul that crosses their path.

Remembering the mistakes is valuable. Definitely. But I believe one has to turn loss to profit by offering each mistake up to God as it comes to mind. Otherwise one could wallow in self-loathing, shame or guilt which gets one absolutely nowhere. It's better to acknowledge the errors than to avoid them. Today, so many people can't even face their transgressions and deny that they did a thing wrong. This is a characteristic of what are termed "abusive" types. See the great book "Why Does He Do That", by Lundy Bancroft for other characteristics. Many people around these days exhibit them.

Why not to actively ask Heaven to accept all sacrifices of the day, offering them to God so He can arrange everything nicely for all good people ?
However, if one sits back and ASSUMES Masons will be removed without intense striving on the part of various people, I feel that's shirking responsibility.

The information is available. We don't know the extent of the cooperation which may have been set in place. But it's a shabby scenario no matter how extensive the contacts were or will be.
The MP-ROCOR flock is already like mummies in tombs: they are so sound asleep, so passive. They cannot be counted on to raise one screech of protest, well except for a Mr J Bently who has a conscience about this, clearly, from the lengthy discussions taking place elsewhere.
I haven't joined in because I tend to post only on this site.
But I would second his motion to call for the deposition of Hilarion, a troublemaker from the start if all stories are even half true!
Giving the MP the deeply sensitive files on ROCOR Holy Land properties, according to the late Mat. Anastasia Grabbe ? He's just trouble, and getting WORSE.

Look at his letter. He says he is not a Mason. Well that doesn't mean anything>. If desperate enough for monetary assistance which may have dried up from MP coffers to a large degree, he may have given his characteristic most Ultra-bland of smiles and nodded in agreement with the Masonic businessmen. I'm not even mentioning the notorious handshake....
One would have to investigate these men, but Jean-Serge maintains at least one was a person of consequence. Probably money or influence were dangled. Who knows what sort of people have paid off those who have ruled in favor of MP-ROCOR in various South American affairs? There could be many angles here, not just the obvious.
Hilarion self-righteously huffs: "A christian can not be a Mason". That's pathetic logic! There are SO MANY examples. Besides some of the Greek Orthodox ruling circles, there was a serious problem among Italian Cardinals and Bishops. So much so that it was frightening. You may discount what I'm saying, but I'll say it anyway! Padre Pio warned strongly that the Pope at the time, Paul VI, was one too. Even the mainstream New York Times had an article on the Latin Mass recently. The writer mentions that the chief architect of Vatican II was almost for sure a Mason. He says the Vatican never denied the allegation, but retired the prelate to a ceremonial post in Iran when the heat got strong. As if to underline the problem from Masons, it was amusing that this example of Masonic destructive meddling was brought out so clearly by the non-Catholic-friendly NYT, at the same time as this bizarre news about Hilarion was emerging.

Masons are agents of the devil; Orthodox and most Catholics have always been their bitter enemies.
So to combat this, the MP-ROCOR flock are supposed to chant mantras like that infamous Buddhist cult in the U.S. instead of rising in protest?
I contend that this one meeting leaked out. It's probably the very tip of the iceberg as far as much wrong behavior by the milque-toast Hilarion. Who knows what he has up his sleeve for the future, what plans are being hatched behind the scenes now ?

Why should TOC people care about this?
Self-interest at the very least. Their Churches stand to benefit if this becomes publicized. Members of MP-ROCOR might finally be jolted into disgust and walk away from Hilarion's mantle. Shouldn't the TOC's be informed about this affair and ready to welcome any new members of the disillusioned, if there are more than a few?
Even on the human level, many TOC Church members had their origins in the Old Rocor, or at least knew people from it. This is the TOC day to shine and say with a nice smile, not a smirk: "We TOLD you SO, this is where compromise with World Orthodoxy has led MP-ROCOR. It only took a year, as this meeting took place in 2008! Quite a precipitous slide downhill for the once-proud and principled ROCOR of the great Metropolitans..."

Finally notice that Hilarion or whoever wrote that email, wrote obliquely. "A Christian can not be a Mason" doesn't state that a Christian should never have any dealing whatsoever with Masons. Besides sliding away from that strict approach befitting a real authentic First-Hierarch, notice how Hilarion terms Masons a religion - HUH?
The man and every one of his acolytes have got to go!
I recommend a coup d'eglise to overthrow the ruling junta, speaking of South American images. Then ROCOR personnel hushed up during the Laurus and Hilarion Administrations could step in to help ailing ROCOR to take hold of its own destiny by throwing off the heavy yoke of the MP.
If when the moment is ripe people are on a mountaintop bemoaning their past problems, maybe they are following their OWN ideas of what God wants for them. Whereas in Fact, God may need them to provide action to overthrow an evil status quo....this is my attitude.