Marian Apparitions vs Visitations of the Saints

[Matthew]

To anyone well versed in Roman Catholic Religion, I have a question.

I told a devout and committed papophile Roman Catholic friend of mine that one of the reasons I know the Roman Catholic Church is a false church is because of visitations by Saints that Orthodox Christians have had where they warn the Orthodox that the Roman Catholics are enemies of Christ. His response was, "These visitations are false! There is not one visitation by saint bearing messages to guide the faithful in the history of the Catholic Church. It is only ever the Virgin Mary who does this. So this proves these visions or visitations you have been reading about are false!"

Is it true that in the Catholic Church, the only Saint that ever visits people with messages is the Virgin Mary?

[Maria]

To anyone well versed in Roman Catholic Religion, I have a question.

I told a devout and committed papophile Roman Catholic friend of mine that one of the reasons I know the Roman Catholic Church is a false church is because of visitations by Saints that Orthodox Christians have had where they warn the Orthodox that the Roman Catholics are enemies of Christ. His response was, "These visitations are false! There is not one visitation by saint bearing messages to guide the faithful in the history of the Catholic Church. It is only ever the Virgin Mary who does this. So this proves these visions or visitations you have been reading about are false!"

Is it true that in the Catholic Church, the only Saint that ever visits people with messages is the Virgin Mary?

Other saints have apparently appeared to Catholics.

However, if you were to check the marian apparitions, you would find that many of them have been ruled to be invalid. Medjugorje comes to mind. The Catholic Bishop of the area has condemned this apparition, but it continues because financially it is so successful.

Serbians have been quick to point out that the so-called "Virgin of Medjugorje" is probably a ghost in that her apparitions are ghost like with the apparition wearing gray garbs. The first apparition took place at the bottom of a cliff, and it was accompanied with the rattling of windows in the village. This was the 40th anniversary of the death of thousands of Serbian Orthodox who were pushed off the cliff of Medjugorje with the help of Nazi-loving Franciscan monks.

See the commercialization at this site: http://medjugorje.org/
The so-called seers did not join the monastery, but are living very wealthy lives due to careful investments of their profits gathered from donations around the world.

[frphoti]

I followed a lot of these apparitions back when I was a Roman Catholic. The main problem I had with them then -as now- is the angry, never to be appeased, ready to destroy the world, Westboro Baptist god they supposedly are trying to spread. They even have to appease the Marian goddess they have created. Even more, they( or the apparition) preach a very syncretistic faith. Look at the Fatima shrine. A tree is known by its fruits.

Did any of these people think that maybe God was trying to get THEM to repent and change their lives? When people see a statue or icon crying, do they ever even think to say "Maybe it's crying or bleeding because we are heretics? Because we have abandoned the True Faith?" and not as a show of a miracle for miracle's sake? The Saints and fathers have shown us that when something like this happens, we should be better off just to ignore it as much as possible in the wider sense. It may be a judgement on us, not a blessing. We would be better off if we took the possible miracle as such. If it is truly a blessing, God's grace will show forth revealing the truly miraculous character of the event, and the affected person's humility will be a crown for them.

[Matthew]

Other saints have apparently appeared to Catholics.

However, if you were to check the marian apparitions, you would find that many of them have been ruled to be invalid. Medjugorje comes to mind. The Catholic Bishop of the area has condemned this apparition, but it continues because financially it is so successful.

Serbians have been quick to point out that the so-called "Virgin of Medjugorje" is probably a ghost in that her apparitions are ghost like with the apparition wearing gray garbs. The first apparition took place at the bottom of a cliff, and it was accompanied with the rattling of windows in the village. This was the 40th anniversary of the death of thousands of Serbian Orthodox who were pushed off the cliff of Medjugorje with the help of Nazi-loving Franciscan monks.

See the commercialization at this site: http://medjugorje.org/
The so-called seers did not join the monastery, but are living very wealthy lives due to careful investments of their profits gathered from donations around the world.

I wish I could convince him of the lies of Medjugorije. but he will not listen. He says, the local bishop is over ridden by Pope John Paul 2 who was okay with it. I haven't even tried to tell him about the Serbian martyrs of the village because he doesn't believe anything the Orthodox Serbs say. Lord have mercy!

[Maria]

Other saints have apparently appeared to Catholics.

However, if you were to check the marian apparitions, you would find that many of them have been ruled to be invalid. Medjugorje comes to mind. The Catholic Bishop of the area has condemned this apparition, but it continues because financially it is so successful.

Serbians have been quick to point out that the so-called "Virgin of Medjugorje" is probably a ghost in that her apparitions are ghost like with the apparition wearing gray garbs. The first apparition took place at the bottom of a cliff, and it was accompanied with the rattling of windows in the village. This was the 40th anniversary of the death of thousands of Serbian Orthodox who were pushed off the cliff of Medjugorje with the help of Nazi-loving Franciscan monks.

See the commercialization at this site: http://medjugorje.org/
The so-called seers did not join the monastery, but are living very wealthy lives due to careful investments of their profits gathered from donations around the world.

I wish I could convince him of the lies of Medjugorije. but he will not listen. He says, the local bishop is over ridden by Pope John Paul 2 who was okay with it. I haven't even tried to tell him about the Serbian martyrs of the village because he doesn't believe anything the Orthodox Serbs say. Lord have mercy!

There are many devout Roman Catholics who say their prayers, try their best to live a godly life, but have been conditioned to believe that theirs is the true Faith. If we were to try to convert them by attacking the Pope of Rome, they might become agnostic or atheistic. I have known many former Catholics who are now agnostic, atheistic, or worse, wiccan.

I think the best approach is to share the lives of our pre-schism and post-schism saints. Invite them to our Divine Liturgy and let them experience true and correct worship without guitars and dancing girls. Once they realize that we have the True Faith with many holy saints like St. Seraphim of Sarov and the New Martyrs of Russia, then they might come to the conclusion that something is wrong with Rome and her worship.

But to attack the Roman Catholic faith head on is bound to have negative repercussions as Catholics will question our faith, hope, and charity asking, "Where is your love?" Scriptures do say that Christians will be known for our love of one another.

St. Seraphim of Sarov said that if we acquire the Holy Spirit, then thousands around us will be converted.

This is true as it is the Holy Spirit who will grant the grace of repentance to those who are honestly seeking the truth.

[Matthew]

I followed a lot of these apparitions back when I was a Roman Catholic. The main problem I had with them then -as now- is the angry, never to be appeased, ready to destroy the world, Westboro Baptist god they supposedly are trying to spread. They even have to appease the Marian goddess they have created. Even more, they( or the apparition) preach a very syncretistic faith. Look at the Fatima shrine. A tree is known by its fruits.

Did any of these people think that maybe God was trying to get THEM to repent and change their lives? When people see a statue or icon crying, do they ever even think to say "Maybe it's crying or bleeding because we are heretics? Because we have abandoned the True Faith?" and not as a show of a miracle for miracle's sake? The Saints and fathers have shown us that when something like this happens, we should be better off just to ignore it as much as possible in the wider sense. It may be a judgement on us, not a blessing. We would be better off if we took the possible miracle as such. If it is truly a blessing, God's grace will show forth revealing the truly miraculous character of the event, and the affected person's humility will be a crown for them.

Yes, excellent point, Fr Photi. They have bad fruit from these apparitions, and many of the visionaries fall into dissolute lives. For example, the visionaries of Our Lady of Salette, who were shepherds, Melanie Calvat and Maximin Giraud--the first ended her life a victim of mystical dementia, the other became an alcoholic.

[Matthew]

There are many devout Roman Catholics who say their prayers, try their best to live a godly life, but have been conditioned to believe that theirs is the true Faith. If we were to try to convert them by attacking the Pope of Rome, they might become agnostic or atheistic. I have known many former Catholics who are now agnostic, atheistic, or worse, wiccan.

I think the best approach is to share the lives of our pre-schism and post-schism saints. Invite them to our Divine Liturgy and let them experience true and correct worship without guitars and dancing girls. Once they realize that we have the True Faith with many holy saints like St. Seraphim of Sarov and the New Martyrs of Russia, then they might come to the conclusion that something is wrong with Rome and her worship.

But to attack the Roman Catholic faith head on is bound to have negative repercussions as Catholics will question our faith, hope, and charity asking, "Where is your love?" Scriptures do say that Christians will be known for our love of one another.

St. Seraphim of Sarov said that if we acquire the Holy Spirit, then thousands around us will be converted.

This is true as it is the Holy Spirit who will grant the grace of repentance to those who are honestly seeking the truth.

This is probably the best approach. There are many CAtholics who fall in love, so to speak, with the antiquity and sense of mystical worship they sense at an Orthodox liturgy. Being attracted is essential. I suppose it is much like this: In the same way that it would ultimately be useless to argue with a woman to fall in love and marry a man based on tearing down others and by building logical reasons why the other is the one for her, it is much simpler for the man to show her love, affection, and attractiveness by virtue and good character and a mature personality. Then she is won over without a fight or the need for convincing or arguments.