The Prayer of the Heart

[haralampopoulosjc]

I started this reply to H [Your name is too long when it's late at night !] 2 pages bac. Then I realized there had been so many posts since then !
INTERESTING DISCUSSION, very informative, thank you everyone !

Here was my answer :

Yes I personally dislike Elder Silouan of Athos. I always wonder what people see in him ? Especially when there are Optina Elders, TRUE Valaam Elders, Glinsk Elders ; in recent times, Metropolitan Philaret of New York, St John Maximovitch of Shanghai and San Francisco... Elder Silouan can NOT compare with these bright lights. He just strikes me as average.

Where is the documentation about Fr Sergius Irtel raising the dead ? That is a VERY STRONG CLAIM TO MAKE !

Also do we know WHAT years Fr Sergius resided in Paris and anything more about that time ? With whom did he associate there ? We all know that Paris was the emigre capital at that time. 1st Berlin, then the Russian emigres moved en masse to Paris. Then the U.S.

So with which Paris group did he spend time, do we have any knowledge about that ? From for example, the memoirs of fellow emigres ?

To sum up so far, I would put Fr Sergius Irtel below Elder Silouan of Mt Athos in terms of validity.

I DO remember the passage from that book, thank you for posting it so it's handy for us all to read.

But it feels like Fr Herman, who was the inspiration behind that Platina publication, left out probably much more besides omitting Fr Sergius' residence at the Abbey of the Holy Name.

By the way, Fr Sergius' insistence on moving his cell to higher ground away from the Spruce Island beach is not particularly remarkable !

Surely common sense and REGULAR foresight would dictate THAT much.
We can NOT work overtime to transform simple anecdotes into assembling a case for Fr Sergius as a clairvoyant elder.

He raised a woman’s baby to life in Paris and this was a well known miracle all over Europe. When you’ve already taken this sort of tone towards him because of your dislike towards Saint Silhouan the Athonite (which seems to be rooted in World Orthodoxy promoting him) which is because his spiritual son Sophrony who is actually the one who’s problematic.. Have you considered that maybe you are wrong about St. Silouan and Elder Theodore and you aren’t as discerning as you might think and your rejection of both of them isn’t rooted in anything you’ve been revealed by God… But, your own personal logical reasoning which is cold and calculating? Maybe it would be wiser to pray about this and see if God or one of the Saints will give you an answer. I believe you would come to very different conclusions if you did that.

“No matter how much we may study, it is not possible to come to know God unless we live according to His commandments, for God is not known by science, but by the Holy Spirit. Many philosophers and learned men came to the belief that God exists, but they did not know God. It is one thing to belief that God exists and another to know Him. If someone has come to know God by the Holy Spirit, his soul will burn with love for God day and night, and his soul cannot be bound to any earthly thing.” - St. Silouan the Athonite

Elder Theodore was born George Irtel in 1904. His father had been a renowned physicist in the Russian Royal Court and a friend of St Tsar Nicholas II. His father’s connections permitted young George to be one of Tsarević Alexei Romanov’s playmate. During the Bolshevik Revolution, George fled across Siberia on foot to Irkutsk. Then learning his mother still in Moscow, he walked back across Siberia. He had been arrested in 1920; afterwards, in 1924 he entered Valaam Monastery as a novice. It was there that Novice George came under the spiritual care of the staretz Justinian. Due to godless incursion into the vicinity of Valaam, Novice George moved on to the Pskov Caves Monastery in Estonia.
Under the care of the Elder Schema-Archimandrite Simeon, Monk George was clothed in the small schema and renamed Sergei (Sergius). Stavrophore-monk Sergei was among the many Russian émigrés to Paris in the 1930s. At the Sorbonne, he earned an advanced degree in Philosophy and was ordained to the priesthood in 1934. It has been said that there were three men consecrated to the episcopacy in secret. Fr Sergei was one of the three. Secret consecrations are outside the norm in Orthodoxy. Nevertheless, these elevations were conducted because there was suspicion that the NKVD (predecessor of the KGB) had targeted certain Russian hierarchs in Europe for assassination. While in France, Fr Sergei had frequent fellowship with St. Archbishop John Maximovitć during his tenure there.

Many in ROCOR considered Elder Theodore to be a Wonderworker. the Orthodox word mentioned him a few times prior to the passing of St. Seraphim Rose. But, it seems no amount of information will suffice once people have made up their minds. This constant need to make everything black and white and “consistent” is the root of this truthfully.

Not everything we have in the Church can be confirmed by documented evidence like we are in a court case. Imagine if we took this same tone towards every Saint in history. We wouldn’t have such a thing as Holy Tradition. We’d be overly rationalistic secular scholars or something.

I believe Vladyka John who knew Elder Theodore and a few others who knew him that go to our Church. if you have any questions about the Wonderworker Elder Theodore you can ask him if you’d like.

Regarding Elder Theodore being a wonderworker, again, so what? Elders Paisios, Porphyrios and Iakovos worked miracles according to the testimony of dozens of people, but we don't regard them as saints. Padre Pio was credited as a wonderworker. So was the Monophysite Pope Cyril VI of Alexandria. Saint Gerasimos of the Jordan was served by a lion and was a wonderworker, he was in error because he would not accept the Fourth Ecumenical Council, drawing along with him thousands of monks in Palestine, until he was corrected by Saint Euthymios the Great and repented.

Being a "miracle-worker" doesn't mean you're a saint or part of the Church. Which is why I keep harping on what SYNOD Elder Theodore was a member of.

“If thy bishop should teach anything outside of the appointed order, even if he lives in chastity, or if he works signs, or if he prophesizes, let him be unto thee as a wolf in sheep’s clothing, for he works the destruction of souls” (Saint Ignatius)

[eish]

...
If I'm reading the story correctly, a heretic took over the see of an Orthodox bishop who was abusing the heretics?

No, it says the heretic repented of his heresy and then took over the see. Regardless of whether his intentions were pure or not, he publicly preached Orthodoxy from there on, with all his followers, and the hierarchy considered this to be a great boon to the Church rather than a loss, to let him have the whole see (of the former heretics and those who had been Orthodox the whole time) in the place of the persecuting bishop, who had been Orthodox the whole time.

I think our brother is asking you to consider whether he should have been refused the see for the sake of a rule, or whether the rule was rightly bent for the sake of souls.