From what I remember hearing, tatoos are a form of pagan culture. If Jesus Christ and the Theotokos didn't have any, then it's not by God's standard.
If I remember correctly the tattos of a cross on a coptic person are so that they can never be forced into accepting Islam. A very respectable thing, IMO - even if they aren't Orthodox.
Nekariou,
Isn't wearing a cross enough significance? The only thing that will force them to be Islamic is themselves. No tatoo will be a protection from that. And like all Coptics, they over-emphasize the meaning of symbols.
So Coptics blend paganism with a slighted vision of Orthodoxy.
Tatooing is still a pagan tradition.
And as you said,
even if they aren't Orthodox.
So you acknowledge that they aren't Orthodox.
So what's your point?
Joasia wrote:Tatooing is still a pagan tradition.
I know you will scream bloody murder over what I am about to post -- but it IS the TRUTH: Culture and religions SHARE things; they evolve. So sometime, things that started out as PAGAN became accepted as okay in the Christian faith.
----------------------------------------------------
They say that I am bad news. They say "Stay Away."
Hmmmm.
Give me an example of a saint with a tatoo.
P.S. Who said this society is based on Christianity?
Example: Easter bunny.....the rabbit is a PAGAN symbol of fertility: they worshipped the goddess Esther.
Example: Santa Clause (the one at the north pole) .....Pepsi Cola invention.
Example: Father's day? Where did that come from?
Oh yeah, let's not forget the great feast of HALLOWEEN!!!
No, I don't think the Theotokos had a tattoo! I just meant that the film was trying, probably inaccurately, to portray the dress of the time. I have not seen the film in years, but when I did, I didn't think some of the Fundamentalist protesters understood the film. I still don't think that film is as bad as this proliferation of books now saying that Mary Magdalene was co-saviour and graham (sorry) like that. Millions of people are reading these books, and it is only going further spread error and a complete misunderstanding of Christianity. I went to a friend's house and she was reading "The Da Vinci Code" and I told her was "theologicaly suspect" and she looked at me like I'm a maniac. Of course, when I told her how long our Pascha service was, she said "you're insane." I think what I mean to say is, as the ideas in these books, become insinuated into "mainstream" religion, it will only drive people further away from the Truth. These ideas are going to be particuliarly appealing to feminists, who oppose any sort of "conservative" faith.
So Coptics blend paganism with a slighted vision of Orthodoxy.
How much of the coptic ritual and associated rites are are from before they left the Orthodox Church, though? I don't know the answer, but I do think some (if not a large part) is from before Chaldian.
Tatooing is still a pagan tradition.
I'd agree that in general yes tatooing is wrong. But this circumstance is -in my opinion (at least as I see it at this point) - an exception.
Of course better than any physical mark on the body is "tatooing" Christ into the heart. Even heavy mind altering drugs and other techniques of brainwashing are unable to remove Christ from such a heart, such as the case of Elder Cleopas of Romania.
So you acknowledge that they aren't Orthodox.
So what's your point?
Even non-Orthodox can provide good / inspirational examples. As someone like me who just has "armchair Orthodoxy" with all the comforts and ease of American life to see someone suffering so much is a wake up call - and at the end of the day a Copt is a lot closer to the Truth than a muslim.
In regards to Copts have tatoos of crosses...
In times of heavy persecution it would be extremely easy just take off the cross worn around ones neck, and try to stay below the radar. Whereas if you have a cross tatooed on your forehead you can't just take it off. Every one will see it, you will have to answer for it [to your persecutors], and may very well lose your life over it. If it keeps one from succumbing to persecutions, then so be it.
And on another point, and at the risk of sounding like an apologist for pagans...
Not all the pagans did or held to was bad, just kinda misdirected. Much as pagans did at their religious festivals, we also have a sacrifice and a common meal. The pagans believed that their ancestors became gods when they died, so we also believe that we will by Grace become what Christ is by nature, ie godlike.
Just some thoughts
