Iconophili's Great Big Thread of Conspiracies!

[Ebor]

Instead of just posting links to articles. Can you, Iconophili, state in your own words just how the Popular Mechanics articles are "de-bunked", please? Do you live in New York or the DC area? Have you ever been to either area that you have any first hand knowledge of the layout? Do you actually have any understanding of maps or architectural engineering or any other subject that is germain to what happened or how things are done (like finding New York City. It's a Big place, it's highly identifiable from the landmarks like the Hudson River, Long Island and the New Jersey shore.)

Why would persons planning such a deed not get information from maps just for starters? You have repeated and repeated that they could barely fly a Cessna. Can you provide an actual quote from a reliable source about this? Not just a link to an article or site, but a quote here? Thank you in advance.

I looked at the original article in the SFGate and the one you linked to that makes personal remarks against the author in an effort to discredit her. She used literary turns of phrase like "whole country". To say that the "whole country" did not personally witness the plane flying into the Pentagon does not mean that therefore no one saw the plane hit it.

Here is a quote from an Washington Post (local paper) article

"I was right underneath the plane," said Kirk Milburn, a construction supervisor for Atlantis Co., who was on the Arlington National Cemetery exit of Interstate 395 when he said he saw the plane heading for the Pentagon. "I heard a plane. I saw it. I saw debris flying. I guess it was hitting light poles," said Milburn. "It was like a WHOOOSH whoosh, then there was fire and smoke, then I heard a second explosion."

Steve Patterson, who lives in Pentagon City, said it appeared to him that a commuter jet swooped over Arlington National Cemetery and headed for the Pentagon "at a frightening rate .‚.‚. just slicing into that building."

There are names, locations and quotes given.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/me ... ttack.html

I suppose we could continue repeating information like the fires in the towers weren't just jet fuel but burning furnishings and carpets and lots and lots of paper. And that steel doesn't have to melt to lose integrity, it just has to start to soften, a process that commonly happens to metals. If you ever get a chance to do some soldering or other metal work such as lost wax casting like I have you will see the chance from solid to softening to "mushy" to liquid. But will the repetition get you to actually respond to us without insults or shouting/all caps?

A number of us here do not agree with your conspiracy ideas. That does not make us blinded by government. You come here only to talk about them, not about religion/EO, the stated reason for this forum. Why?

Would one of the Moderators please tack this thread on to the end of the "Big Conspriracy Thread" in this subforum? Thank you.

Ebor

[AndyHolland]

I saw the so-called debunking of PM webpage you provided earlier and it was filled with errors and inuendo without facts. [the webpage itself]

As to the cell phones, your conspiracy theorists are in Canada where the number of cell towers and probably their type is different and the "tests" were conducted. In the US, people do make illegal cell phone calls to folks on the ground.

The chances of getting through are extremely low, but it does and can happen. Panicked passengers had nothing else to do but hit redial or use the airfones (which people may have mistakenly referred to as cell phones).

Receivers may have assumed that the call came from a cell phone when in fact it was from an airfone - such as Ted Olson.

The few cell phone calls were of low quality, short duration if there were any cell phone calls at all (again, the poor quality may have led people to believe they were getting cell phone calls when they were getting airfone calls). There was one report of a cell phone call from a bathroom to a 9-11 emergency operator but it was very short duration.

As to the 9-11 commission report, ineptitude, incompetence, lack of attention to detail on the part of our government in compiling the report is a more plausible explanation for inconsistencies. They probably took the reports of witnesses verbatim, and did not check to see if it was a cell phone or airfone.

People know the voices of their loved ones. They weren't all part of a grand conspiracy!

andy holland
sinner

[Ebor]

It's interesting how personal attacks on people who disagree with conspiracies and innuendo are common in articles like the one linked to in the first post on this thread. I sometimes wonder why the writers of smarmy remarks and suggestions on the personal lives of people who disagree with them are not realize that such will not help their cause. Nor does ignoring testimony and witness accounts like the ones in the Post article. It clearly states that people on the ground saw the plane hit. So, as has been stated before, there are witnesses. It was a plane, not a missile or anything else.

There was an article on the front page of the Washington Times today about a serious lack of knowledge of geography amongst younger people/students. Map study is not as common as it once was, apparently. Could this contribute to the conspiracy theorists idea that it's hard to find New York City from the air while flying along the east coast of the US, I wonder.

Ebor

[尼古拉前执事]

Would one of the Moderators please tack this thread on to the end of the "Big Conspriracy Thread" in this subforum? Thank you.

Ebor

Dear Ebor,

I will do that as soon as we have the merge capability back. I will be at Ioannis' house this weekend, so we will definitely have the functionality by then.

Dear Iconophili,

Please keep all of the conspiracy theories in one thread. Thank you in advance

[ICONOPHILI]

Why would persons planning such a deed not get information from maps just for starters? You have repeated and repeated that they could barely fly a Cessna. Can you provide an actual quote from a reliable source about this? Not just a link to an article or site, but a quote here? Thank you in advance.

I looked at the original article in the SFGate and the one you linked to that makes personal remarks against the author in an effort to discredit her. She used literary turns of phrase like "whole country". To say that the "whole country" did not personally witness the plane flying into the Pentagon does not mean that therefore no one saw the plane hit it.

Here is a quote from an Washington Post (local paper) article

"I was right underneath the plane," said Kirk Milburn, a construction supervisor for Atlantis Co., who was on the Arlington National Cemetery exit of Interstate 395 when he said he saw the plane heading for the Pentagon. "I heard a plane. I saw it. I saw debris flying. I guess it was hitting light poles," said Milburn. "It was like a WHOOOSH whoosh, then there was fire and smoke, then I heard a second explosion."

Steve Patterson, who lives in Pentagon City, said it appeared to him that a commuter jet swooped over Arlington National Cemetery and headed for the Pentagon "at a frightening rate .‚.‚. just slicing into that building."

There are names, locations and quotes given.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/me ... ttack.html

I suppose we could continue repeating information like the fires in the towers weren't just jet fuel but burning furnishings and carpets and lots and lots of paper. And that steel doesn't have to melt to lose integrity, it just has to start to soften, a process that commonly happens to metals. If you ever get a chance to do some soldering or other metal work such as lost wax casting like I have you will see the chance from solid to softening to "mushy" to liquid. But will the repetition get you to actually respond to us without insults or shouting/all caps?

A number of us here do not agree with your conspiracy ideas. That does not make us blinded by government. You come here only to talk about them, not about religion/EO, the stated reason for this forum. Why?

Would one of the Moderators please tack this thread on to the end of the "Big Conspriracy Thread" in this subforum? Thank you.

Ebor

1. This is The Miscellaneous Section, if you don't like it, get out, 2. Moderators, I've already talked to Fr.Siluan he understands, where I'm coming from, thats why I'm not banned by him, if thats what your trying to ask, if you don't believe me just E-Mail him, 3. You keep asking me, for my explaination, I wanted to take it to the next level, by giving you sites, that have EXPERTS, saying the official reasons of 9/11 are false, why did I do that, well you could have easily stated I (ICONOPHILI) am just an untrainned guy, what do I (ICONOPHILI) know about STEEL, Planes, so inorder to just cut to the cit chase, I went staright to the experts, testamony, so you want my explaination, well here it is, I lookat it this way, 1. There wee books written about the coming NWO, and how the U.S. Gov has been HIJACKED by the Zionists scince 1913 and howthey slowly were pushing our Nation away from the Constitution, so latter on in the future they can bring in some form of A TOTALITAIRIAN Governmet, and all the major events that have been going on-happening to USA, are being used to push us towards a New Form of Goverenment, which is commenly called "The New World Order", Look at Patriot Bill, loook at HomleLand Security, just spying on us, not the S. Araibians, but us, why?, the real reason is so they can find out who's talking about The NWO, and trying to show whats going on, so when they do take over these people will be targeted for Extermination by the Gov, they use different "Methods to bring us closer to the NWO, A. Disasters, B. Wars, C. so called attacks on our nation, and one of the final things the'yll use is a created Fination Collapse, read this trust me it will open shock you: part 1. http://www.hermes-press.com/econ1.htm part 2. http://www.hermes-press.com/econ2.htm

[ICONOPHILI]

1. This is The Miscellaneous Section, if you don't like it, get out, 2. Moderators, I've already talked to Fr.Siluan he understands, where I'm coming from, thats why I'm not banned by him, if thats what your trying to ask, if you don't believe me just E-Mail him, 3. You keep asking me, for my explaination, I wanted to take it to the next level, by giving you sites, that have EXPERTS, saying the official reasons of 9/11 are false, why did I do that, well you could have easily stated I (ICONOPHILI) am just an untrainned guy, what do I (ICONOPHILI) know about STEEL, Planes, so inorder to just cut to the cit chase, I went staright to the experts, testamony, so you want my explaination, well here it is, I lookat it this way, 1. There wee books written about the coming NWO, and how the U.S. Gov has been HIJACKED by the Zionists scince 1913 and howthey slowly were pushing our Nation away from the Constitution, so latter on in the future they can bring in some form of A TOTALITAIRIAN Governmet, and all the major events that have been going on-happening to USA, are being used to push us towards a New Form of Goverenment, which is commenly called "The New World Order", Look at Patriot Bill, loook at HomleLand Security, just spying on us, not the S. Araibians, but us, why?, the real reason is so they can find out who's talking about The NWO, and trying to show whats going on, so when they do take over these people will be targeted for Extermination by the Gov, they use different "Methods to bring us closer to the NWO, A. Disasters, B. Wars, C. so called attacks on our nation, and one of the final things the'yll use is a created Fination Collapse,
   What these Conspirousy-Revilers say is what I believe scince it, makes sceance, Those guys could not have flown those planes, Cell phones could not have made those calls, even the article I posted that you just quoted from shows how the SF. Chronical lady could NOT answer those questions that the guy gave her, didn't you read that part, that was one of the most important parts of his re-buttel !! Here some of the Experts: 1. http://www.physics.byu.edu/research/energy/htm7.html 2. http://www.rense.com/general17/eyewitne ... ersist.htm 3. http://www.rense.com/general59/ul.htm

[CGW]

OK, so a guy from the water testing side of Underwriter's Laboratories questions details of an NIST report, and this is supposed to be a conclusive refutation?? :ohvey: No wonder UL fired him.