Holy Thorn of Glastonbury

[AndyHolland]

In science, it only takes one counterexample to disprove a theory.

The theory of natural selection as THE ORIGIN of "species" was disproved before it began, by a certain thorn tree in Glastonbury England that blooms on old Christmas (Orthodox Christmas) and according to Orthodox tradition, came from the staff of Joseph of Arimathea.

http://www.christmas-day.org/glastonbury-thorn.html

The tree has decided, since recorded time, to bloom on Orthodox Christmas according to the Orthodox Calendar based on the astronomical tropical year (when the earth passes through the plane of the ecliptic), as opposed to the seasonal year (when the season's are reckoned as repeating- Gregorian Calendar). The yearly eleven minute time difference is faithfully recorded and accounted for - by the tree. While it is of Middle East origin, so are other Hawthornes in England that bloom in May (they must be Roman Catholic and Protestant trees )

The other annual miracle of Holy Orthodoxy is also closely associated with Joseph of Arimathea, and takes place in a cave in a hill in Jerusalem.

http://www.holyfire.org/eng/

How does a tree know the tropical year? All external forces it would experience (light heat - seasonal variance) from a geocentric standpoint are seasonal (includes the precession of Earth's wobble). This tree apparently follows the stars - as 'those who worshipped the stars were taught by a star to worship the dayspring from on high.'

The 3500 year old prophecy is fulfilled, "The Blessing of thy father have prevailed above the blessings of my progenitors unto the utmost bound of the everlasting hills; they shall be on the head of Joseph, and on the crown of the head of him that was separate from his brethren" This prophecy is very, very deep and contains an exposition of the blessing of Divine nature over human when one considers that Jesus was crucified outside the camp (separate from his brethren).

The Lord crowns the year with goodness, and the British crown receives the bloom from Joseph's staff to this very day. And Joseph who was at a hill in Jerusalem, built a Church to Jesus on a hill at the utmost bound of the Roman empire.

Please continue the fight for the Orthodox calendar.

yours in Christ,

andy

(in defense of Darwin, who is no longer thinking, I think the tree is smarter than me - at least in its ability to keep Astronomical time)

[CGW]

In science, it only takes one counterexample to disprove a theory.

The theory of natural selection as THE ORIGIN of "species" was disproved before it began, by a certain thorn tree in Glastonbury England that blooms on old Christmas (Orthodox Christmas) and according to Orthodox tradition, came from the staff of Joseph of Arimathea.

The Thorn is a sport-- whether miraculous or natural, it does not matter, because either way natural selection has nothing to do with this.

The tree has decided, since recorded time, to bloom on Orthodox Christmas according to the Orthodox Calendar based on the astronomical tropical year (when the earth passes through the plane of the ecliptic), as opposed to the seasonal year (when the season's are reckoned as repeating- Gregorian Calendar). The yearly eleven minute time difference is faithfully recorded and accounted for - by the tree. While it is of Middle East origin, so are other Hawthornes in England that bloom in May (they must be Roman Catholic and Protestant trees )

It is unclear from googling whether the tree does bloom at a fixed date in the winter. It also blooms in May with other hawthorns. Indeed there seems to be a difference of opinion as to which species it belongs. In any case the behavior seems to be retained in cuttings but not in the seed; the present thorn is at least two generations of cuttings from the original.

All references to its exactitude of calendar appear to trace back to the same source: an article which is said to have been published in Gentleman's Magazine in 1753. The Bodeian has made this magazine available online, but their offerings only run up to the year 1750; indeed I am unsure as to whether it was even published in 1753. In any case the current custom of cutting it for the queen's table tends to suggest that such a late flowering is exceptional.

[AndyHolland]

There was a great deal of misinformation in googling. For example, one site stated that the bloom was provided to the Monarch in 1929. Yet the monarch (George ?) was dismayed that the bloom occurred on Old Christmas in 1752-53 when they changed the calendar upon receiving his blooms. Also, Charles I commented that the blooming confirmed the Anglican view rather than the Roman Catholic and owing to Orthodox calendar and so on. The tree was ancient when it was cut down by Puritans in the British Civil war, and cuttings are what remain and bloom today.

As to Natural Selection and ORIGIN, your mistaken. One is not disputing variation, speciation, extinction etc... Origin goes to first cause.

The first cause of the Universe is obviously an intelligent cause - God - because man has intelligence and intelligence cannot arise out of any random process or collection of random processes - even ones with adaptive preference (in which case the preference would be intelligent God). It is easily and mathematically provable to understand how intelligence cannot arise out of randomness*.

Natural selection would not favor intelligence, unless the pattern - genetics of intelligence was already there. Darwin was actually correct in that, but those ideas are from Paley (intelligent design).

There really is no new science of natural selection unless it goes to Origin, and Darwin himself knew and communicated in Origin of Species that it was impossible to formally prove. Therefore, technically, it is more philosophy than hard science.

This does not mean that speciation is incorrect, or change, though gradualism is disproved by the Cambrian explosion in the fossil record. Genetics is clearly far more powerful in forming intelligent life than external factors that promote statistical adaptation (bug colors and so on).

The Holy Thorn has no external data upon which to base the date of its blooms. A tropical year is defined by distant stars so that one can compute the passing through the plane of the Ecliptic. The tree apparently does so, and kept time accordingly.

It was emphatically stated that natural selection is not the ORIGIN (first cause) of species. Earth Life is part of an objective function for a genetic algorithm of stunning complexity, that can re-program itself. We cannot even understand that objective function fully nor describe it completely owing to the complexity involved. In other words, variations may occur un-noticed for a host of reasons beyond our ability to closed form objectively explain. This is similar to Heisenburg's uncertainty principle, we cannot know for certainty the position of particles, we can not know for certainty the Origin of speciation by observing it. This is similar to God is unknowable in essence.

Darwinism and the junk science that claims everything is "simple" is, was and always will be a huge fraud. Scientists need to understand their limitations and not make grandiose claims that their theories explain Origin when that cannot be established by observation and there are fundmental reasons why it cannot.

andy

*e.g. "Mary had a little lamb" - assuming 1 billion keystrokes per second on your keyboard, and allowing for miscapitalization, it would take nearly 70,000x longer than the universe has existed to cover the possibilities to type the phrase randomly. 27²² power, and compute the seconds of the Universe based on KOBE background microwave data (13.7 Billion years in seconds).

Consider the algorithms of the brain that process distance and size correctly in 4D (including time) for a game of catch. Any computational or mathematical language adequate to express the operation is infinitely more complex than "Mary had a little Lamb." The ancients understood the power of "word" and why there is a God. Modern scientists who say otherwise are fools - "the fool says in his heart, there is no God." They have not studied the fundamental limitations of science, observation and mathematics that are in fact real.

[CGW]

You know, by posting a bunch of random, mostly dubious assertions, you do your side of this no favor-- if indeed there are even "sides".

[AndyHolland]

There was a reporter from a newspaper who went to East Cicero Il. to cover the phenomenon of a weeping Icon. He took hundreds of photographs, and they all came out wonderful. The only problem was, none of the photos showed the obvious tears on the face of the Theotokos. He clearly saw them when he took the photographs.

In humility, he called the Priest at the Church, and confessed what happened and stated that he now believed. The Priest allowed him to take just one photograph, and that world-famous (amoung Orthodox) photo clearly shows the tears.

One can come up with 1000 scientific explanations as to any number of miracles. If you choose not to believe, God's mercy is such that there are plenty of excuses, and you don't have to. No one can compel you. If you do believe, nothing will stop that either.

There are many people claiming "scientific knowledge" who assert there is no God and no reason for God - scientifically. They are liars and frauds. They tell the people something that is not true, and the people believe they can sin because these "wise men" know better. They destroy themselves and others.

Darwin was a God hater, and his ideas led to WWI, WWII and nearly destroyed the planet in the Soviet Union and masonic America. Perhaps it is time for the other point of view, those who believe in God and work in science, to be heard.

If you have patience, perhaps you can go - one by one, through my dubious errors.

andy - the dubious asserter

[1937 Miraculous Cross]

Andy,

you've provided some thought provoking posts. How the Thorn bush is in tune with solar/celestial events is beyond understanding.

in Christ,
Nectarios

[CGW]

There was a reporter from a newspaper who went to East Cicero Il. to cover the phenomenon of a weeping Icon. He took hundreds of photographs, and they all came out wonderful. The only problem was, none of the photos showed the obvious tears on the face of the Theotokos. He clearly saw them when he took the photographs.

In humility, he called the Priest at the Church, and confessed what happened and stated that he now believed. The Priest allowed him to take just one photograph, and that world-famous (amoung Orthodox) photo clearly shows the tears.

Name the reporter, name the newspaper, and name the date. There is no mention of this incident on the church's own website.

Darwin was a God hater, and his ideas led to WWI, WWII and nearly destroyed the planet in the Soviet Union and masonic America. Perhaps it is time for the other point of view, those who believe in God and work in science, to be heard.

The first statement is untrue. The second statement is untrue. By the time we get to the third and fourth statements the chain of causality is stretched so far that almost any link can be made plausible. And when you brought up the masons, I stopped listening.