What Does Your S.F. Say About The Jesus Prayer?

Justin Kissel

What Does Your S.F. Say About The Jesus Prayer?

Post by Justin Kissel »

I'm curious as to what the different spiritual fathers (or advisors, or confessors) of the members of this board say about the Jesus Prayer. Is it ok for a layman to say it? What if he only says it 10 minutes a day and never plans on going beyond that point? What's the point of it? Should you seek guidance in such things. If so, from whom? I already know the answers to these questions as given by many of the texts floating out there online, an in different books. I'm curious what those to whom we look to for guidance in real life has to say about these things, though.

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Mary Kissel
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Post by Mary Kissel »

When I was in the OCA, my spiritual father told me that it was ok to pray for a short period of time when saying the Jesus prayer, even if you don't intend to or plan on praying longer in the future. He said to me that since I wasn't a monastic that I did need to be careful to not go into it as deeply as the monastics might with their prayer rule. So I would say that yes, it is ok to just pray it for 10 mins or even less. From what I got from him and from "The Way of the Pilgrim" we all should say the Jesus prayer, at least for a few minutes or so everyday.

MaryCecilia

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Liudmilla
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Post by Liudmilla »

An old spiritual father of mine once said that one should practice the Jesus prayer, but not alone and not without guidance. Such things should only be approached with the guidance of a practioner.

Justin Kissel

Post by Justin Kissel »

I have seen from most people the type of caution being described.

I'd think a thread on the Jesus Prayer would be of interest... perhaps I was too narrow in my question. Anyone want to add something about this subject, apart from something your spiritual father may or may not have said?

Steve
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I say it as often as I remember ...

Post by Steve »

it helps me get through the day. I don't have a spiritual father to guide me in these things and since chanting it helps me, I plan on continuing. I have been doing it since my Dad died in 1997 (not bragging or prideful, it is a wonderful help but hard to maintain.) How can it be harmful? I don't do the sitting and breathing, I just say it whenever I walk or swim or when times get quiet.

What are the other cautions besides pride, if any? I have read "Pilgrim" several times and try to heed its advice as much as possible.

Justin Kissel

Post by Justin Kissel »

Sounds great, Ole rocker /\ Please don't take the following as though directed at you--it sounds like the following wouldn't describe you at all.

Some of the dangers are a pride that's normally very hard to detect in oneself. It's the same sort of pride/apathy that people get when they "go through the motions" (as far as Church practices) for too long without any real feeling or zeal. We all have dry times, of course, but after a while dryness can become our normal state. I've heard the same thing about the Jesus prayer (and prayer in general, though I've heard it mostly about the Jesus prayer). After a while, if you aren't careful and don't have a discerning eyes watching over you, you can fall into a state in which you say the prayer as well and as much as ever, and you seem to "feel" the prayer as much as ever, but in reality your heart is hardening and you are falling further from God. It's a sort of prelest, or spiritual delusion. The thing is, it's hard to notice this in yourself. If you're the one being deluded, then it's hard to identify it as an error (since part of the delusion makes you think that everything is just fine).

For instance, Marcus Borg and other Jesus Seminar types might say hours upon hours of prayer, and they might "really mean it" or "feel it"--but that doesn't mean that they are making progress. Sometimes we fool ourselves into thinking that we are on the right track. How can "prayer" be wrong, after all? But the way it can be wrong is that it can feed into a barely perceivable pride--an somewhat apathetic pride--so that, when a person is confronted with the real spiritual truths by God, they don't recognize them. They are so stuck in their (prayer and other) habits, thinking them "good things," that they can't discern the better thing when it comes along. They also have a hard time discerning when things go south. The devil is always looking to plant thoughts in the heart, even if he has to do so by coming in the back door.

A spiritual father who can closely watch you is of course the best situation, though this isn't possible for everyone (and perhaps in this time and age this is the rare thing). So, humility and watchfulness seem the best antidotes. Part of the problem with the Jesus prayer in particular--at least from what I've read--is that it's such a "simple" thing that we take it for granted if we aren't careful. This shouldn't come to a suprise to us though as this is human nature. Of the hundreds of thousands of the "mixed multitude" that came out of Egypt and wandered in the desert, how many made it to the promised land? They had daily miracles performed, and yet they lacked faith. Also, the 10 men that Jesus healed comes to mind, where only 1 came back to thank Him. Jesus asked "I healed 10, but where are the other 9?" It's perhaps part of our fallen human nature to want to see signs and miracles. It's also, unfortunately, part of our human nature to grow apathetic, prideful, or even spiteful, when we experience God's grace.

If one does a study of miracles and people's reactions--especially as seen in the Bible--it becomes clearer how the Jesus prayer (a good thing in itself: indeed one of the best of things) could have bad results. The unfortunate fact is, most of us are unprepared for God's grace, and when it comes, most of us either reject it, grow prideful because of it, or forget about it almost immediately. The parable of sowing on four kinds of soil comes to mind. I'm definately not saying to stop doing the Jesus prayer. But we must all be careful, lest we too worsen our condition rather than bettering it by attempting to partake in God's grace in a way that we are not ready for (another thing along this line that comes to mind is how Paul talked of those who were sick and dying because they took unworthily of the eucharist).

Steve
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Good advice ....

Post by Steve »

and I will definitely ponder over it. There could possibly be some of this in my life and I ask your prayers that God will reveal that to me. I don't want to have a hard heart or prelest or take medicine that I am not ready for. I think it's time for me to seek out Fr. Peter again!

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